Trains that 'chug'

darthsylly

Hi all,

First time poster! My son and I have enjoyed starting with TM2, going back to the Tomy trains and now Plarail.

I've noticed some of the trains seem to 'chug' and not run very smoothly. At first I thought this was just an issue with second-hand toys being dirty, but recently I bought one of the ES-08 C12 locomotives brand new with the carriage and it 'chugged' straight out of the box.

Here's a short video of what I mean:

[video=youtube]https://youtu.be/_cBq6RnOF3c[/video]

Is this normal? Did I receive a dud? Can it be fixed? Should I return it to Amazon?

Thanks for your thoughts and help

Super

I have had many 'chugging' engines in the past, most were used though. I don't think I have had a C-12 new out of the box though and the ones I have now don't do the chug. Why not return it to Amazon since their Returns are so easy and see what another one does. For the most part, if my memory isn't leaving me, I think all of the ones I had that ended up chugging were the Thomas Type motors which I think the C-12's run with.

BTW: welcome to you and your son to BluePlasticTracks Darth ðŸ˜ƒ

darthsylly

Thank you for the kind welcome!

You know... the other 'chuggers' I have... are both Thomas engines.

I'll try another C12 and report back when that happens. Might be a while! Thanks a lot

Super

I know I had worked on a couple of chuggers but I can't remember what I did besides disassembling the box motor, checked or replaced cracked gears and lubed it up and can't remember if it fixed the situation or not. I do remember that I either fixed a chugging Cargo Liner or replaced the box motor entirely but it doesn't chug anymore.

Please let us know if a replacement fixes the problem.

mitzalplik

I've had a chugging issue too with 1 or 2 of my Trackmasters in the past (used) and just like Super, It was so long ago and I've also done a plethora of things to the engine as one does when buying used engines in general that I don't remember what the cause of it was I'd be guessing because of my limited experience with chugging engines. But maybe check if the running wheel axels gear is cracked or otherwise loose (because of said crack). That is, if you don't choose to return it.

Super

Mitz, do you remember if your chuggers were the square Thomas type motors or one of the handful of other types?

mitzalplik

Yes actually So vaguely I remember lady chugging a bit and fixed that (but can't remember how because it wasn't the primary issue I was fixing/cleaning)

But I definitely remember belle chugging. But in her case, it was either because her wheel axel gear was missing a tooth, or loose from a cracked gear. (Loose from a cracked gear might have been a different engine entirely)

Chugging engines were a rarity for me, probably only two. Have people who notice chugging engines typically state the engines are square type? That be interesting to look into but that would be a challenge since all my engines, even spares don't suffer chugging enough to notice.

Super

All the chuggers I have come across are the square Thomas type motors

darthsylly

Thanks for adding to the discussion @[deleted]!

I've decided to keep this one (I'll order another soonish) and open it up. Not super easy to get into! The gears visible on the outside look fine, I'm just wondering if the motor is simply not up to it. I'll see before too long.

I noticed on this (admittedly old) video where one of the 'modern' C12 runs there's a slight chug to it (4:37):

[video=youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Di4TMLaX7nM[/video]

Super

I don't see the 'chugging' in the video but thanks for bringing out a video from our beloved creator of BPT's Ucwepn 😃👍✔

darthsylly

Haha, always good to have a few more views! Maybe my eyes are playing tricks on me. Just seems like every time the wheels go round there's a very brief, very subtle moment where it slows down?

chrisjo

I've got a Plarail KF-02 HD300 Hybrid Loco that's been a serious chugger right from BNIB.

I've had it completely stripped down, gearbox and all, twice, without finding anything at all wrong with it.

But it Keeps On Chuggin', as Robert Crumb didn't say.

Donald9Douglas10Oliver11mp

It could be down to a bit of slack in the gear train, witch when running builds up and then realeses, due to maybe the spring on one of the gears, or it could be down to a bad conection between the motor commutator and brushes, those are the only things I can think of

darthsylly

Well I had the C12 apart this evening. No cracked gears (should hope not, since it's new!) and no noticeable dirt or debris causing an issue. Motion of the gears seems okay when run by hand, although that isn't a particularly scientific test!

The one thing I must say is that there is clearly some stress on the motor when the chugs happen, you can hear it slow down for that moment. Same noise as pressing down on the engine as it's running.

The motor inside is soldered in. I'll order a torque-tuned motor and get my soldering iron out when it arrives, and take it from there.

Super

Let us know how it turns out

darthsylly

Small update, I bought a new motor, a Tamiya Hyper-Dash 3.

Installing it wasn't too tricky, the photo shows some dissasembly and the new motor soldered in place with one terminal on a metal plane that goes around the side of the housing and the other to a wire that connects to the far battery terminal.

And... it still chugs. Although it runs faster so the chugging is much less painful to witness.

I'll still buy another C12 soonish and see how that performs.

Super

How closely did you inspect the worm gear that slips on the shaft that is on the motor itself. You test with a new motor seems to narrow it down to gearing...right? I have seen a very fine split in the worm gear that is not very noticeable and affects engine performance. Do you have a lighted magnifier glass? Hoe hard was it to remove and replace from the old to the new motor shaft?

darthsylly

Yes, I'd say it ought to be a gearing issue at this point. Unlikely to be the housing.

The worm gear wasn't too keen on coming off, so I held it in hot water to soften the plastic. Then it popped off fairly easily. I didn't notice any cracks but I'll happily inspect under a magnifier when I re-open it (I do have a lighted one)

If I get another C12 that runs nicely I'll swap some parts around to try and narrow the issue... or break the pair of them!

Super

If it was tough to get the spur gear off then I would have to assume that its fine especially if it was the same resistance when putting it on. If you have it apart again, check out real closely the other gears with the magnifier as they cracks, if any, can be hard to see even to the trained eye. Also, I think there may be a large, flat, round gear that is being driven by the motors spur gear, its on a metal shaft of it own, make sure its not loose from that shaft and it meets the spur gear in its middle.

darthsylly

Sounds like good advice, thanks! I'll update again when there's news. Even if no fix, it would be nice to prove why it chugs.